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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pufferfish View Post
    I dig them specs! That's amazing pricing if they hold to the same % in the US!

    130hp doesnt sound like much but 2160 pounds is not a lot to pull around. This thing is gonna be fun.
    Exactly what I thought when I saw it in Autoweek. There's pretty much no way it'll sticker for US$10k in the US, but we can hope for under $25k (or even under $20k as others have said). I hope they do bring it here. Can't wait!

  2. #32
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Balance is everything

  3. #33
    Member shark_bait88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ichitaka05 View Post
    He does make some fair points about how the process of developing complex products, like cars, occurs.

    Although, from a marketing standpoint I'd be all for just about anything that gains international attention for a new product. Play into the rumors, offer coy remarks that don't confirm anything but elude to exciting specs/details. Unless of course the specs that were leaked were better than what we actually knew we could do...
    "What's the point of wearing your favorite rocketship underpants if nobody ever asks to see 'em?"

    2013 FR-S:17x7 Kosei K1 TS track/autox wheels, Berk single-exit muffler delete, and PMU Club Racer track pads.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shark_bait88 View Post
    He does make some fair points about how the process of developing complex products, like cars, occurs.

    Although, from a marketing standpoint I'd be all for just about anything that gains international attention for a new product. Play into the rumors, offer coy remarks that don't confirm anything but elude to exciting specs/details. Unless of course the specs that were leaked were better than what we actually knew we could do...
    I do agree... but at the same time, which & what Toyota manager?

    Can't say much, but this project is under ZR department which is pretty high up of the Toyota/Lexus Racing/Gazoo Racing department. No ordinary Toyota manager gonna know tiniest info about this.

    & if you guys are wondering, Tada-san, who is Chief Engineer for FT-86 is the head of ZR department & no, hes not a Chief Engineer for this project, but he do over look this project (if that make sense).
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    Balance is everything

  5. #35
    Member Tcoat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vracer111 View Post
    Not sure there's $8k worth, but here's some differences that would allow for a cheaper price than the FR-S:

    1) 1.5L I4 Toyota motor verses 2.0L Subaru Boxer motor
    2) No LSD (assumed)
    3) No Air Bags in seats (assumed), or alternatively airbags in seats but no side curtain ones...or maybe no airbags except for driver and passenger ones...
    4) More extensive use of Toyota parts-bin components
    5) Re-using some parts developed for the FR-S (cost sharing)
    6) 4-bolt versus 5-bolt design (hubs/brakes/wheels)
    Quote Originally Posted by cinephile View Post
    ^^ I think these are good possibilities, though I assume the airbag systems aren't going to be skimped on with the crash safety standards of today. Also, the front and rear suspension appears to be simplified from the FR-S. Perhaps dialed in from test mules and then made more cheaply than FR-S suspension parts with less potential for drastic re-adjustment.

    But I do hope an LSD is at least an optional package if not standard. If it's not even available I'd be less interested. The 130hp sounds fine but open diff only would be rather boring. I think it will be optional at the very least.
    Yes the airbags will not be able to be eliminated or it will never pas the N.A. side impact crash test requirements.

  6. #36
    Member shark_bait88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ichitaka05 View Post
    I do agree... but at the same time, which & what Toyota manager?

    Can't say much, but this project is under ZR department which is pretty high up of the Toyota/Lexus Racing/Gazoo Racing department. No ordinary Toyota manager gonna know tiniest info about this.

    & if you guys are wondering, Tada-san, who is Chief Engineer for FT-86 is the head of ZR department & no, hes not a Chief Engineer for this project, but he do over look this project (if that make sense).
    That all makes plenty of sense. I've heard that working for a Japanese automotive company is pretty similar to working for a German automotive company, which I know a thing or two about.

    I'm seriously questioning who that "Toyota manager" is as well. Since only one, rather obscure, source seems to have him as a source. If Toyota really wanted to debunk these rumored specs, they'd likely issue an official statement or press release.
    "What's the point of wearing your favorite rocketship underpants if nobody ever asks to see 'em?"

    2013 FR-S:17x7 Kosei K1 TS track/autox wheels, Berk single-exit muffler delete, and PMU Club Racer track pads.

  7. #37
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shark_bait88 View Post
    I'm seriously questioning who that "Toyota manager" is as well. Since only one, rather obscure, source seems to have him as a source. If Toyota really wanted to debunk these rumored specs, they'd likely issue an official statement or press release.
    I can tell you, even these info to be false, they won't do press release to clear things up. Cuz they want these rumor and story to keep going to bring more interest.

    Just like FT-86 Concepts, they let em happen with all the turbo and AWD rumors.
    Balance is everything

  8. #38
    Member Tcoat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vracer111 View Post
    Not sure there's $8k worth, but here's some differences that would allow for a cheaper price than the FR-S:

    1) 1.5L I4 Toyota motor verses 2.0L Subaru Boxer motor
    2) No LSD (assumed)
    3) No Air Bags in seats (assumed), or alternatively airbags in seats but no side curtain ones...or maybe no airbags except for driver and passenger ones...
    4) More extensive use of Toyota parts-bin components
    5) Re-using some parts developed for the FR-S (cost sharing)
    6) 4-bolt versus 5-bolt design (hubs/brakes/wheels)
    Quote Originally Posted by shark_bait88 View Post
    He does make some fair points about how the process of developing complex products, like cars, occurs.

    Although, from a marketing standpoint I'd be all for just about anything that gains international attention for a new product. Play into the rumors, offer coy remarks that don't confirm anything but elude to exciting specs/details. Unless of course the specs that were leaked were better than what we actually knew we could do...
    Quote Originally Posted by Ichitaka05 View Post
    I do agree... but at the same time, which & what Toyota manager?

    Can't say much, but this project is under ZR department which is pretty high up of the Toyota/Lexus Racing/Gazoo Racing department. No ordinary Toyota manager gonna know tiniest info about this.

    & if you guys are wondering, Tada-san, who is Chief Engineer for FT-86 is the head of ZR department & no, hes not a Chief Engineer for this project, but he do over look this project (if that make sense).
    If you read some of his other blogs you will note he seems to think very highly of himself and obviously has a deep personal hatred of anything Toyota.

  9. #39
    Member Nevermore's Avatar
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    I wonder if my dad has any information. He's not in the automotive design part, but he's an engineer and has access to many things. I just have to watch out because he loves to make things up and has a tendency to sound very convincing.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
    If you read some of his other blogs you will note he seems to think very highly of himself and obviously has a deep personal hatred of anything Toyota.

    I didn't even bother reading other article. It's same person who can't even spell "S-FR" correctly in other article he wrote. If you're wondering here's the article (SF-R)
    Balance is everything

  11. #41
    Junior Member cyde01's Avatar
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    Honestly, the magazine scans look very much to me like scans from Japan's Best Car magazine. Best Car is known mostly for rumors of unreleased cars, and is known to wildly embellish their predictions of future models. However, sometimes they do get their info right. Example: they were the first to report that the FT86 might have a Subaru flat-4, they had this info even before Moto-san from Club 4ag new about it. They also had extremely accurate renderings of the finalized design of the FRS, LFA, and GT-R before they were released to the public (albeit maybe a week or two before official photos were released).

    Having said all that, I would call these specs educated guesses about what the final specs might be based off of knowledge of Toyota's current lineup and possibly discussions with insiders. The price sounds more and more like wishful thinking.
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  12. #42
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyde01 View Post
    Honestly, the magazine scans look very much to me like scans from Japan's Best Car magazine. Best Car is known mostly for rumors of unreleased cars, and is known to wildly embellish their predictions of future models. However, sometimes they do get their info right. Example: they were the first to report that the FT86 might have a Subaru flat-4, they had this info even before Moto-san from Club 4ag new about it. They also had extremely accurate renderings of the finalized design of the FRS, LFA, and GT-R before they were released to the public (albeit maybe a week or two before official photos were released).

    Having said all that, I would call these specs educated guesses about what the final specs might be based off of knowledge of Toyota's current lineup and possibly discussions with insiders. The price sounds more and more like wishful thinking.
    You're prob 90% true... except Moto-san part. He knew and saw the design before anyone outside of Toyota. iirc he met with Tada0san and saw the design in '07
    Balance is everything

  13. #43
    Junior Member cyde01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ichitaka05 View Post
    You're prob 90% true... except Moto-san part. He knew and saw the design before anyone outside of Toyota. iirc he met with Tada0san and saw the design in '07
    I know Moto-san was getting the inside scoop directly from Tada-san, but he did not know about the flat-4 initially. Back when we were on Club4ag discussing the new hachiroku and the rumors of a flat-4 first started coming out on Best Car and Mag X, he was disappointed just like the rest of us and wished it wasn't true. But he eventually warmed up to the idea. I think this was before the first FT86 concept was even shown.
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  14. #44
    Member shark_bait88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ichitaka05 View Post
    I can tell you, even these info to be false, they won't do press release to clear things up. Cuz they want these rumor and story to keep going to bring more interest.
    Exactly the point I made earlier.
    Likes Ichitaka05 liked this post
     
    "What's the point of wearing your favorite rocketship underpants if nobody ever asks to see 'em?"

    2013 FR-S:17x7 Kosei K1 TS track/autox wheels, Berk single-exit muffler delete, and PMU Club Racer track pads.

  15. #45
    Senior Member Ichitaka05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyde01 View Post
    I know Moto-san was getting the inside scoop directly from Tada-san, but he did not know about the flat-4 initially. Back when we were on Club4ag discussing the new hachiroku and the rumors of a flat-4 first started coming out on Best Car and Mag X, he was disappointed just like the rest of us and wished it wasn't true. But he eventually warmed up to the idea. I think this was before the first FT86 concept was even shown.
    He purposely denied about boxer engine til Toyota officially announced praying that it wasn't true. He's a hardcore 4AG (& i6) fan. He still have bittersweet feeling about boxer engine lol
    Balance is everything

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